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Discussion Starter #1
ive been closely planning my purchase of a 2003 9-5 aero wagon, then taking it to the maptune stage 5. would it be cost efficient, and would it be reliable? would i basically need to change out everything in the car? im still considering that rs6...
 

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From what I've found out price wise:

MY2003 9-5 Aero Wagon + Maptun Stage 5
350BHP


39000 + 8,246.24 = USD$47246.24

VS

Audi RS6
450BHP

US$82,700.00

On a HP per dollar basis the 9-5 wins. But if I were fortunate enough to be in your position and I could afford the RS6 I'd go for that. Simply because it has all-wheel drive, if the 9-5 had AWD I'd say go for that one.

and would it be reliable?[/b]
Couldn't say, I'd need a 9-5 tuner to answer that. But common sense says that a more highly tuned car will be more wear out it's components more quickly. Certainly with Saabs, it seems to be transmissions which break under the increased strain.
 

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Hi,

for the price difference between the Aero and the RS6, you could have the Aero shipped to Maptun, have them tune it to 500 hp ("Maptun Individual", Fredrik from Maptun has a 500 hp 9000 Aero I think) and ship it back to you... perhaps you could save one way by buying a Swedish Aero online, have it Maptuned and shipped to you.

I think ind the end, you would still save a few bucks, and you would have the strongest Saab in the States.

Yours,

Philip
 

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But, I would have thought that the RS6 is a much more sorted car. If you can afford it, buy the Audi and get the speed restrictor programed out for those salt flat runs.
 

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Hi Misha,

Guess its partly an uneven match as the Audi is customised by Gmbh from the start and the Matun is a "standard" car being tuned up!

But that said, after driving my bosses 340 HP Audi S6´s (non turbo) and comparing it against my own 9-3 FPT with only 185 HP and the standard 9-5 Aero with 250 HP, I would thing that you get more value for money in the SAAB´s! The audis are loosing approx 20-30% on the fourwheeldrive and autoboxes! So the 340 HP of the S6 actually equal´s the 250 HP of the standard Aero. The Saab will always loose on the drag strip due to loss of traction but from 45 mph and up they will match the S6! But I dont think they can match the twin turbos of the RS6!!!!!! A Maptune step 5 might just match a RS6, but as I havent tried neither so I cant say for shure.

The SAAB you can upgarde step by step, the Audi will but you back 83 Grand right away, and dont se how you will ever be able to use the full potential of the RS6 in the US. That beast is made for one thing only, 2000 miles long, 6 lanes autobahns without speedlimits!!


Søren
 

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I think I can give you a hint on Saab 9-5 Aero performance with 350+ hp. A few months ago, Hirsch entered a 9-5 Aero tuned to about 355 hp in the Tuner GP at Hockenheim. It wound up running faster laps than two RS6's that were modded to the tune of about 550 hp.

True that a RS6 will win the stoplight grand prix, it is too heavy to be effective at much else. It is a very capable car for alot of things but its very heavy weight does not help very much.
 

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Originally posted by Eric (9-3 Hirsch):
[qb]I think I can give you a hint on Saab 9-5 Aero performance with 350+ hp.  A few months ago, Hirsch entered a 9-5 Aero tuned to about 355 hp in the Tuner GP at Hockenheim.  It wound up running faster laps than two RS6's that were modded to the tune of about 550 hp.

True that a RS6 will win the stoplight grand prix, it is too heavy to be effective at much else.  It is a very capable car for alot of things but its very heavy weight does not help very much. [/qb][/b]
Interesting that Eric, I wouldn't have guessed that the RS6 would be so heavy! Thinking about it now, I remember that the new S4 was criticised by some car mags for being too heavy, it was considerably heavier than the current M3 IIRC.
 

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The RS6 have a sound to die for , but as Eric shows is far to heavy , like the RS4 , this is autobhan stormers . No fun , no pleasure . And , for same very important , an impossible heavy suspension , the roads have to be like a circuit , or if you like to drive a shacker .
 

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I guess then that this has also been the downfall of the new Volvo V70R which has received such lukewarm reviews in the UK motoring press.

It appears to weigh in at around 1720kg which means it isn't actually much faster than a 9-5 Aero wagon in factory spec, and will be slower than an Aero with a Speedpart or Hirsch upgrade to anything more than 280bhp.

Most of the mags are in favour of the Alpina B3.3, but does the BMW stigma affect the Alpina or are the driven by rational people instead?

So what is the ultimate go faster wagon?????
 

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This is the ultimate go faster wagon :



Audi RS2 2.2litre 5 cyl, Intercooler, Turbo, Quattro, 6 speed - Built and tuned by Porsche. 310Horsepower standard. 360 Horsepower with MTM chip... reliably tunable to 400HP... and weighs a useful 200kilos LESS than a 9-5 wagon.... wooosh.
 

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I'd agree about the RS2, especially as it'll outrun a Mclaren F1 to 30mph!
There was a piece about it in one of the car mags where they phoned Audi UK to ask how to get the best acceleration from it for test results. They were told that following discussions with the Audi HQ that they should take it up to 5000rpm and sidestep the clutch. The car mag then asked with some surprise "Are you joking?". The Audi spokeperson replied "They are German and engineers, they don't joke!"
If only you get an RHD one at a sensible price, I think I'd be very tempted. Altho' I hear bills on the Porsche derived parts aren't cheap.
 

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And of course there is the noise.......
That 'ol 5cyl 20v Audi turbo does make a wonderful sound, especially when pushing more than 300 gee-gees.......don't forget these engines could produce a reliable and tractable 600hp in the quattro sport group B rally/rallycross cars....
 

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The only thing about the RS2 that was negative in my experience was the huge turbo Laaaagggggg,
I whipped one at GTI international in my 190+bhp Mk1 Golf on the 1/4mile because he didnt have the guts (or he had some mechanical sympathy
) to drop the clutch at obscene revs demanded to launch a 4 wheel drive car effectively,
I think the spectators were surprised to say the least

Pete.
 

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with the Audi HQ that they should take it up to 5000rpm and sidestep the clutch  [/b]
In one of the very old Top Gear mags I have, they said side step the clutch @ 7000rpm.

Either way, I'd like to see it done....provided I don't have to pay for any of it!

Skiddins
 

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Originally posted by aeropilot:
[qb]And of course there is the noise.......        
That 'ol 5cyl 20v Audi turbo does make a wonderful sound, especially when pushing more than 300 gee-gees.......don't forget these engines could produce a reliable and tractable 600hp in the quattro sport group B rally/rallycross cars....      [/qb][/b]
Perhaps I should ship my old Audi 500 off to Turbo Technics, then, and see what they can do with the 5cyl lump. Talk about a wolf in sheep's clothing

Before this turns into a thread about performance Audis (of which I am a great admirer, particularly the older ones), allow me to get back on topic:

Misha, my understanding is that you can order your car to US spec through Saab's IDS (International and Diplomatic Sales) arm in Sweden. The price should be more than competitive with that in the US, the warranty treatment should be the same, and they'll throw in shipping home for you.

You can then take up Philip's suggestion of taking the car to Maptun yourself and having them do the work - let's not underestimate the benefit to be had from getting the tuner to fully sort your car for you. And you get a holiday in Sweden while you're waiting

Cheers

James

PS Saw an RHD RS2 for sale here back when there were R20 to the pound - should have bought it, and sold the Aero. Oh well.
 

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Glad to see you're still considering a 9-5 Aero as the ultimate Stealth machine

Quite like the sound of philip hs's idea of shipping the car to Maptun for a 500BHP 'special'!

If you are willing to spend the money, which I believe you are, I'm sure you will achieve your goal with a Saab. Would love to see the look on the BM / Porsche / Ferrari drivers faces when your station wagon leaves them standing!



Go for it!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
thank you gentlemen for all your commentary. i like the idea of purchasing the car abroad and geting work done there, then bringing it back to vegas, however that is too much time invested. if i went that far, i would most likely turn to Hirsh. still not sure if maptune is the best company for me to go with... hirsh is more expenisve but i would not mind paying for that extra benefit. i will research all the costs of importing a european tuned aero, but i will most likely puchase it domestically for convenience reasons.
 

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Hirsch won´t give you more than 305 hp with warranty, and not more than 325 hp at all, AFAIK. MapTun, on the other hand, might give you 500 hp for the same price ;-)

Yours,

Philip
 
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