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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is being fitted on Friday 11th March, just in time for the suffolk meeting on the 12th !!!

I CANT WAIT for the


So we can see how its doing on the Rolling Road

Rob
 

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I'll be upset if it's more than mine...

but then mines an old 1993 8.5 CR car so it might be lower than thise new fangled 1994 9.3 CR beasts.

A
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
HI Guys

Maptun say 265 bhp on my 1999 9-3 Se Turbo, but I have the Viggen Intercooler and a Catless downpipe, so who knows !!!! I cant wait !!!!!
 

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Yes, if your car is the 2.0 Trionic 5 with Garret T25 turbo, 260 hp is about the max. The later T7 HOT with Mitsu TD04 can reach 270-280 hp with a very good software.

Yours,

Philip
 

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Originally posted by philip hs:
[qb]Yes, if your car is the 2.0 Trionic 5 with Garret T25 turbo, 260 hp is about the max.[/qb][/b]
Maybe 20 hp more if you have race fuel. Saab ignition timing is very conservative. Just don't expect much more on standard pump-gas. Sorry for any confusion this creates.

Adrian W~
 

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Originally posted by philip hs:
[qb]Yes, if your car is the 2.0 Trionic 5 with Garret T25 turbo, 260 hp is about the max. The later T7 HOT with Mitsu TD04 can reach 270-280 hp with a very good software.

Yours,

Philip [/qb][/b]
Garrett T25 can not leave 260 hp for longer than 0.0x seconds. It's wayyyy too tiny/restrictive for that purpose. But, 0.0x seconds is enough for some of us...

Just my 0.02.
 

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Originally posted by philip hs:
[qb]Yes, if your car is the 2.0 Trionic 5 with Garret T25 turbo, 260 hp is about the max. [/qb][/b]
Strange. My Trionic 5 with T25 produces "only" 269.6bhp on the dyno Evidenced by Dave Walker's conservative Emerald rolling road and witnessed by people on this board.
Originally posted by philip hs:
[qb]... and that´s why Robs car "only" produces 256 hp according to the dyno.
[/qb][/b]
Rob's car needs the base boost checking as it is thought to be out of specification since the new downpipe was added. Hope the facts clarify the situation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
My car recorded 256 bhp and 275 lbft torque on Sat, as John says base boost needs checking and should be checked this week, Not by me as dont have the first idea how to do it !!!!!!!!
 

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Rob's car needs the base boost checking as it is thought to be out of specification since the new downpipe was added. Hope the facts clarify the situation.  [/b]
That´s what some tuners always say when the cars don´t deliver the promised power. Ask the users 9-5aero and mushdaffer. I was told the same by Abbott, btw, and adjusting the base boost did not change a thing. The next suggestion made by the tuner will be to change the spark plugs. I think 256 hp is a realistic and good result for a non-custom-tuned ECU with non-Stage parts.

@ John: I have a hard time believing in a T25-car producing 270 hp. This is the figure you get when you install a Viggen IC and Viggen turbo on the 2.0 litre and let Hirsch do the remap, like Maarten did ... which does not mean I don´t believe you. It´s like you say, very strange. BTW, what did you do to your car? Your SaabScene-homepage still says Speedparts Stage II, ~235 hp.

Yours,

Philip
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Phillip

I was pleased esp with the smoothness of the car.

Having driven Johns car I believe the results and also have seen the results on here !!!! his intercooler is the size of a small house !!!!

Rob
 

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Hi Rob,

an IC by itself will not make any power, it will just help making power. Limiting factor is the turbocharger, because it can transport only a limited amount of air (milligram per combustion cycle). For example, to reach 300 hp, you need 1300 mg per combustion cycle at 5500 rpm.

It is hard for me to find the right words for this in English, but I will try. You have to look at the efficiency map of a turbocharger. You can find those for most Garret chargers online. There, you will see the amount of air a turbo can flow.
As the turbo speed increases, the charge air gets hotter and hotter. Hot air is not efficient anymore. Surely at big IC will help, but at 5500 rpm, you should not have an intake temp of more than 55 °C, or your EGT will get to high. Plus stress on the charger will be very hard, too. It will not live very long under these conditions.
Although it might be possible to see slightly more than 260 hp on a T25, it is most surely no good idea.

Yours,

Philip
 

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Hi

As i have understood until now it's useless to compaire dyno numbers from different dyno facilities. Thats why i opened the thread about dynos. There are so many variables, which complicate the whole situation. There are Dynojets, who give higher dyno numbers, then Mustang dynos (more realistic), HP corrected to SAE, to DIN, or not at all corrected! From a dyno to an other we could also have differencies although they use the same equipment.

9-5 aero
 

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Originally posted by philip hs:
[qb]@ John: I have a hard time believing in a T25-car producing 270 hp ...Your SaabScene-homepage still says Speedparts Stage II, ~235 hp.
[/qb][/b]
I did not say 270bhp, I said 269.6bhp. This was witnessed by three other contributors to Saabscene when we visted the Emerald Rolling Road on 20th Dec 2004.

I do not understand why you continue to disparage the results of others, in the light of the facts, just because of your own experiences or prejudices?


And my profile page was updated after the rolling road!
 

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Hi Philip,
I hope /john won't mind me interjecting here.
/john has done quite a bit to his 9-3, but the turbo itself is unmodified (ie; it is a T25). As you said in your original quote '260bhp is about the max for a T25', in /john's car the boundaries have been pushed a bit further.
We're only talking 9 bhp more than your estimate after all. It's not like /john is claiming 300bhp is it?
I can also see the value of an oversized intercooler. If the intake charge is significantly cooler, it will be denser and with the correct fueling/ignition advance will it not produce more power?
Nick.
 
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