Saabscene Saab Forum - Saab Technical Information Resource banner
1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
99 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Can someone advise on rather I would need a front end alignment along with my purchase of new tires, or a 4 wheel alignment. I just purchased my 9000S last week, and I need 4 new tires. I understand that this is a front wheel drive vehicle, but does this mean that I only need a front end alignment? Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,216 Posts
Only the front toe-in is adjustable (I believe this is the case on many modern rear-wheel-drive cars too). However, since you have just acquired the car, it would be prudent to have a four-wheel alignment check performed this time round. This will highlight any problems that might need to be addressed. Any misalignment at the rear would indicate wear or damage which would need to be corrected.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
192 Posts
Basically anywhere thats decent will do what is classed as a 4 wheel alignment check.

The front end is the only thing that is actually adjustable on the Saab. Unless you get the drill out and mess around for ages with offset washers etc.

What they do, or should do is clamp a laser unit to the front wheel and a reflector to the rear etc etc amnd check the alignemt. Basically the car shoudl be straight, the camber should be equal side to side, the rear toe should be identical side to side and the front should be adjusted accordingly.

The front may have to be done a bit funny so it drives straight as no car is ever perfectly straight./ its worse of course if you have belted a kerb with the rear or something.

2 wheel alignment with each other is ok but you will most likely get pulling to one side or the other, at best 2 wheel alignment prevents the tyres wearing badly.

Chris
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,172 Posts
Only the front toe-in is adjustable (I believe this is the case on many modern rear-wheel-drive cars too).  [/b]
Not on the 9-5 Rear toe is also adjustable
What they do, or should do is clamp a laser unit to the front wheel and a reflector to the rear  [/b]
They might have done this years ago? 20 years or so but some garages may still do it
The proper 4 wheel alignment machines are all computer controlled laser guided! with a high accuracy and at least 4 laser heads.
The machines will test.......
1.run out of the wheels
2.caster
3.camber(front and rear)
4.front toe
5.rear toe
6.inclination angle
7.set back (front)
8.Total toe (front and rear)
9.thrust line (rear axle)

You also get a print out that tells you all the measurements plus highlights any problems.
Well worth having a proper one done (but not cheap) ask at you local accident repair center if they do this service (they should) and get a price
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
192 Posts
Yes they check all of that with things clamped to the wheels.

Unless they have now as if by magic managed to get things so advanced that they can detect the wonky angle of the tyres, the run out of the rims, the bend in the chassis etc. They still clamp onto the wheels.

To check the castor angle the wheels need to come off or at least the specific suspension set up inputed in and then the wheels turned and even then its tricky as you have KPI angles etc.

Chris
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,172 Posts
Chris no magic involved,the machine is computer controlled and all the manufacturers specs are in the memory and updated every year or can manually be typed in for new cars before an update disc is available.
As for the points you made about " managed to get things so advanced that they can detect, the run out of the rims, the bend in the chassis" yes the machine I use does does take all this into consideration. as I said before in no:1,no:7 and no:9
The whole process is done on a specific 4 post ramp with swivel plates at the front and rear and takes about an hour to complete.
Trust me the machines are very accurate and do measure everything and more even the KPI.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
192 Posts
The ultimate wheel alignment rig is Hunter which is American made. The newest version is the DSP 400 or 500 or something can't quite recall. The price is the wrong side of £30,000.

You have a ramp onto which you drive the car, then you place the reflectors on each wheel. At the head of the rig there are the laser pods, these show up as a figure of 8.

The car is driven onto the ramps which has swivel plates and the clamps are fixed to the wheels. The car is also moved back and forth to take rim run out into account. The wheels are turned through 180 degrees to get this measurement with the reflectors fitted to the wheels.

Attached to the rig, well plugged into it is the PC. In this you select the manufacturer, country, model and age. You can then input if it has been lowered etc.

It measures all you said and it does measure the KPI, but its a lot more involved than a quick gander at the wheelarch.

Anyway for any adjustments the screen comes up with a pic of the compoenents and tells you what to do to adjust them. This is for the 2 day apprentices, as adjustment is very easily and you need to be a right dolt to not understand how to adjust it.

Also the set back is checked on all 4 wheels, although some of them have a funny fit when they see an old renault, as the nearside has a longer wheelbase by 2 inches than the offside.

Anyway the point is you were trying to say they don't clamp things to the wheels, and they do. I know about these things and I even may claim I know how to use one. My sarcasm with the by magic comment maybe a bit cheeky but hey just

Theres actually a fair few cars that can be adjusted front and rear in every direction, although most if they are lucky extend to rear toe angles and thats about it.

The problems with a lot of cars is the tightest tolerences work to about a 5mm sphere of pick up point location, I believe the lotus elise works to the toightest tolerences of any road car at a 3mm sphere which is very good. A lot of cars are anything up to an inch or so out.
Chris
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,172 Posts
Anyway the point is you were trying to say they don't clamp things to the wheels  [/b]
Where in any of my posts have I said they do not clamp things to the wheels? I picked up on your point that they have a laser on the front and a reflector on the rear! when that is not the case nowadays,all the heads have at least one laser in them.
I use a Bear ccd machine (Pace 100) nearly every day and I do know what I'm on about,If you add a greamlin after tongue in cheek comments it may be read better saving confusion.
All I did was post a reply clarifying what measurements the modern machines calculated and how accurate they were.
To check the castor angle the wheels need to come off or at least the specific suspension set up inputed in and then the wheels turned and even then its tricky as you have KPI angles etc.
 [/b]
But as you said in your last post the machine does all this for you with no removal of wheels,
It measures all you said and it does measure the KPI, but its a lot more involved than a quick gander at the wheelarch.
 [/b]
Not tricky then at all

I'm not trying to start a slanging match over this so don't take this the wrong way
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,216 Posts
Originally posted by Saabman:
[qb] QUOTE
Only the front toe-in is adjustable (I believe this is the case on many modern rear-wheel-drive cars too).  [/b]
Not on the 9-5 Rear toe is also adjustable [/qb][/b][/quote]You have a rear-wheel-drive 9-5?
Not trying to start a slanging match, you understand
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,524 Posts
Now there's a thought. A rear wheel drive 9-5. Put in a rear engine to achieve it. Leave the front engine of course, tune them and get 600 bhp of power


Shouldn't take up much more room than Leon's LPG tank

I think a chap did this to a Mini many years ago. Front engine was manual gearbox, rear engine was auto so it just followed along, no awkward synchronisation problems - or so he said.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,216 Posts
Originally posted by sgould:
[qb]I think a chap did this to a Mini many years ago. Front engine was manual gearbox, rear engine was auto so it just followed along, no awkward synchronisation problems - or so he said. [/qb][/b]
He found room for a second engine in a Mini?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,531 Posts
Originally posted by BillJ:
[qb] QUOTE
Originally posted by sgould:
[qb]I think a chap did this to a Mini many years ago. Front engine was manual gearbox, rear engine was auto so it just followed along, no awkward synchronisation problems - or so he said. [/qb][/b]
He found room for a second engine in a Mini? [/qb][/b][/quote]Going completely off topic..
how about a V8 transverse in a mini, no major panel/chassis mods?
Mini V8
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,524 Posts
I think it ended up as a two seater, same as the one where the man put the Rover V8 in the back of a Mini, but still driving the front wheels


Still something to think about when you've got used to the next Aero upgrade
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,216 Posts
Originally posted by Leon 9-5stg2:
[qb]how about a V8 transverse in a mini, no major panel/chassis mods?[/qb][/b]
As a former Mini enthusiast, I must say I do like that. Especially the fact that it looks like a standard Mini. It would put my old modded 1275GT to shame, no question.


When was the last time you sat in a Mini, Leon
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top