Exit, Stage one or was it left, Pink Panther..

5410 Views 17 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Avantissimo, Nov 16, 2004

Saviour

Discussion Starter · Nov 13, 2004

Stage one

Hi Guys, on a 97 9000 CS LPT Auto. Which Stage one would you go for?
Map Tune or Elkparts? Elkparts which seem to give far more for the money, i.e. 76BHP & 141Nm @ £442.99, against MT’s 75BHP, 130Nm @ £556.76.
The car has only done 76K miles and in very good condition but I would like more punch within the mid range, Overtaking. Also I know I will need to put a 3” exhaust on but will Cat back do, or will I need the full system?
TIA  Andy

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Dulux

· #2 · Nov 13, 2004

I chose the Speedparts stage 3 as I already had full exhaust system (must include 3"down pipe) and J&R air filter, so it made sense.

Maptun seems the choice if you intend to go further than stage 3, where as speedparts is cheapest bang for your bucks.

The biggest effect is the increase in torque, the power is nice although it would seem that different cars behave in different not just depending on ecu, eg some cars are completely off the wall where as others are just okay.

You will also need to adjust the base boost level if a 3" downpipe is fitted about 2 turns on the wastegate rod (see billj's website) cannot remember which way!

I was concerned when I changed ecu that I may cause damage to the car in some way but as yet no problems, in fact averaging a better mpg, but that may just be different driving conditions.

Have Fun, Dulux

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sgould

· #3 · Nov 13, 2004

You will need to be certain that your supplier of choice is able to adequately protect your auto gearbox from excess torque. It is for this reason that the FPT versions of the 9000 auto only run to 200hp, whereas the manual FPT goes to 225hp.

Saviour

Discussion Starter · #4 · Nov 13, 2004

able to adequately protect your auto gearbox[/b]

This is one of the reason that I have held back on moding my 9000, already had to replace the autobox this year so not quite ready to do it again. so bearing in mind that it's auto, who would you buy from, EP or MT ?

markcanderson

· #5 · Nov 13, 2004

Maptun. From everything I've read, I'd say that Maptun would be the people to buy the upgrade from. They understand Saabs.

BSR, the maker of the 'Speedparts' chip upgrade are a general tuner (kind of like Superchips), who do ECU chip upgrades for lots of other cars so can't possibly put in the development time needed to hone a product.

Maptun however are ex-saab factory. They only deal in Saabs. They have access to knowledge, testing, training, documentation material and people that BSR probably don't have.

The HP isn't the issue.. it's the max torque you will ask the box to deal with. The box is rated to be able to handle 290NM.. push it much over that and you may encounter problems. Also note that the shift patterns will be slightly screwed up with the very different torque curve.

Steve-Stage 2

· #6 · Nov 14, 2004

Since you have the auto box on your 2.0ltr I would reccomend speaking to both of them,the Speedparts power tends to be more mid range on the 2.0ltr lpt with a gradual increase in torque from approx. 2750rpm, thus saving the box.
Speedparts now do the lower stage mapping in-house having moved away from bsr, the higher mapping stages are done by SQR.

Maptun is also a well respected tuner and do all their mapping in-house, if I want to further increase the power on my 2.0ltr (manual)...currently Speedparts Stage 4, I would have no hessitation in dealing with them due to the feedback from this and other sites.

I chose Speedparts on price, my first upgrade was about £100 cheaper at the time of ordering compared to Maptun, so bang for buck was much better.

Steve

mark e

· #7 · Nov 14, 2004

2

Ideally, you should have software that's mapped for an auto. I don't know for definite if either do this, but if they don't then analysis of the torque curves is very useful:

I would say the Maptun (on the left) one is likely to be "kinder" to the autobox as it is less peaky, and holds it's torque higher up, meaning that you're less likely to need a kickdown to a rev range that all of a sudden has a big difference in torque.

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Saviour

Discussion Starter · #8 · Nov 14, 2004

So, from what I'm reading here, Elkparts/speedparts is the way to go, sounds good to me.
I plane to do this next March/April time, get the bad bit of winter out of the way first, that will also give me time to fit the exhaust, full system I think.
Thanks for all your input guys.

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aeropilot

· #9 · Nov 14, 2004

Originally posted by Bacardi:
[qb]So, from what I'm reading here, Elkparts/speedparts is the way to go, sounds good to me.
[/qb][/b]

Must have read something different to me then

Saviour

Discussion Starter · #10 · Nov 14, 2004

Must have read something different to me then[/b]

Which bit did you not read ?

andycannon

· #11 · Nov 14, 2004

I would say the Maptun (on the left) one is likely to be "kinder" to the autobox as it is less peaky, and holds it's torque higher up, meaning that you're less likely to need a kickdown to a rev range that all of a sudden has a big difference in torque

As per "Bubbles" reply!

95power

· #12 · Nov 14, 2004

Choice between Maptun vs. Speedparts ( = BSR ) is very easy: Maptun. Period.
Speedparts sells pure bulkstaff. They do not make their uppgrades themselves ( = middleman ).
Maptun upgrades are just superior, what comes to long run reliability and performance.
I drive myself with maptun stage 5 with my 9-5, and I can strongly recommend their products. Technical support is there, if you'll need it. Johnny and Fredrik knows what they are talking about.

Avantissimo

· #13 · Nov 14, 2004

2

Originally posted by 95power:
[qb]I drive myself with maptun stage 5 with my 9-5, and I can strongly recommend their products. [/qb][/b]

Hi 95power,
I'm honoured to note that you have a Maptun Stage 5 = 480Nm.

Could you kindly share your experience with that source of power? Must be out of this world!

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Saviour

Discussion Starter · #14 · Nov 14, 2004

So the Auto box will take 290Nm, both MT & EP are well within this with EP giving more for your € at 141Nm against 130Nm from MT, still not sure, I need two guys with one or the other, what have you got to say? so far I have heard from people with upwards of stage 4 and even 5,

markcanderson

· #15 · Nov 14, 2004

Your at about 210/220NM as standard .. With +130NM or +140NM obviously you'll be sitting with about 40NM to 50NM more than your box is rated to take ?

i.e. neither of the upgrades is comfortably lower than the manufactured limit of your box... they are both HIGHER!

Aside from the quality of the mapping from Maptun, the lower torque of the maptun ecu will preserve your box.

95power

· #16 · Nov 14, 2004

2

Originally posted by 9-5 ff:
[qb] QUOTE

Originally posted by 95power:
[qb]I drive myself with maptun stage 5 with my 9-5, and I can strongly recommend their products. [/qb][/b]

Hi 95power,
I'm honoured to note that you have a Maptun Stage 5 = 480Nm.

Could you kindly share your experience with that source of power? Must be out of this world!

[/qb][/b][/quote]My car is originally 9-5 2.3LPT, MY1998, sedan with manual gearbox. I bought B235R ( from MY2002 9-5 aero ) engine and low mileage gearbox ( MY2003 ) for the start point for this project. I bought these from Sweden.

B235R engine was with low mileage, but I decided to rebuild and balance it just to be sure. I sold original pistons and replaced them with forged ones from Maptun ( JE ). Original camshafts were replaced with stage 5 ones from Maptun as well. Balance shaft chain and tensioner were removed. ( B235R was originally from automatic aero, so I used my original flywheel from my B235E. Btw, the flywheel was just balanced, no lightening here = Maptun recommendation ).

Because my 9-5 had plenty of miles on the clock, lots of parts ( too many to list here, but basically half of the car was upgraded with new std or performance parts ) were installed at the same time with stage 5 installation.

Everything was quite straightforward in this project. Stage 5 Trionic upgrade put check engine light on at first, but this was because my car had only one lambda sensor; I called Johnny at Maptun, and he fixed this and sent upgraded software in two days! No problems since.

I just finished ( actually yesterday ) my break in for my new engine ( my break in was 5000 km. I made first oil/filter change at 600km ). I've not measured the performance yet, but dyno tests will be done next friday ( 19.11 ) here in Finland. If you are interested, I can publish the results here.

What comes to power of this car with Maptun 5, I can tell you, it's awesome. The pull is incredible with all gears. Torque curve makes it very easy to drive even at normal traffic. Fuel consumption is almost original with normal driving as well. But what comes to driving at WOT, it's hard to describe. Usually - after I take my son to school I will go just driving around for a while with big smile on my face. If someone will ask me, would I do this again, I can honestly answer: It's worth every penny.

BTW, I'm going to make some modifications to airbox before dyno tests ( - currently airbox is original, but Johnny recommend to make some minor mods to it), and Hyperboost HX bypass will be installed as well.

I'm driving currently with winter tires, and weather conditions here in Finland are not so great for fast driving with these power levels

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Saviour

Discussion Starter · #17 · Nov 15, 2004

Ok, Ok, my minds made up, I'll increase Map tunes profits. Thanks to all who participated in my quest to better understand.

Avantissimo

· #18 · Nov 16, 2004

I've not measured the performance yet, but dyno tests will be done next friday ( 19.11 ) here in Finland. If you are interested, I can publish the results here.[/b]

Hi 95power,
I share your fine experience.

I am also on a similar stage with you but I have an auto gearbox. However, I have never dynoed the car yet but I would certainly look forward to learn about your results. I have taken out the snorkel and drilled many holes into the cylindrical box. The power is simply frantically explosive:thumbsup: ....could not express it in words.

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