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Discussion Starter #1
Finally bit the bullet and just had a Maptun Stg 3 fitted to my CSE 2.3T. I haven't noticed much difference in the feel of the car, still really smooth, but there is a bit of a pleasant burble from the JT exhaust. The giveaway that something special is going on is the rate at which cars in the rear view mirror become tiny specks, and the fact that the clutch is clearly not up to it now (well it has got 110k miles on it) as it slips madly if you floor the throttle in say 3rd gear
.

So what clutches have those of you with modified cars got? Is a new standard clutch up to the job or is it better to get a paddle type sports clutch? Any other options available?

Cheers,
Matt
 

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The limitations of friction on a standard clutch are governed by the state of the clutch material, flywheel, and how "tired" the pressure springs are.

There are two main perfromance options- the paddle type clucth as supplied by AP or a full plate clutch assembly supplied by Sachs IIRC.

The AP paddle has the advantage of being a lot cheaper, and lighter in both weight and pedal effort. However, it is more brutal than the Sachs and after a while the take up judder inceases significantly as it tears the surface of the flywheel. Eventually you will need ot have the flywheel surface re-machined (I'm just about to have this done
)

So, my recommendation as you're not yet at the "silly torque" stage would be to stick with a conventional clutch, but make sure the flywheel surface is OK and also replace the pressure spring section.
 

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I would add that the sachs clutch is very good with a very smooth action
As reported it is relatively expensive but in this case you get what you pay for
recommended if you can afford it and you have monster torque....
 

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Discussion Starter #4
So just to clarify... is the Sachs item you are talking about the standard Saab item or is it an uprated one?

Thanks
Matt
 

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Agree with a previous post, dont fit a paddle clutch to a car you intend to use on a regular basis,they are far to brutal and are either on or off with no prgressive bite.

I fitted a Borg + Beck clutch to my last car a 300 BHP 280lbt 4WD Subaru and it was perfect,everybody said get an AP or a Helix but the B+B was way cheaper and never once caused a problem in 33K miles.

Dont always believe the hype with the expensive options.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks guys! Sounds like my best bet is to go with the uprated Sachs (assuming not too pricey) as I do get stop-start driving conditions more often than I'd like, and a paddle clutch appears to be a bit too extreme for everyday road use.

I'm looking forward to even more
than now once I can actually get the full torque applied to the wheels... no doubt wheelspin will be the next thing to contend with, oh well, one thing at a time.

Matt
 

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Matt,


I had a Gearbox rebuild, LSD and standard clutch fitted in may '03 and went stg3 in September '03 and so far have been very pleased.

I'm not to sure just how long it will last (the last was ok at 130,000m), but it's still fine after 10,000m and 3 trackdays.

Andrew.
 

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With a standard clutch you could be very close to the limit of your clutch. My car started to slip (280bhp originally) so I fitted a new standard Sachs pp and drive plate. After a few months it started to slip a bit. I had not resurfaced the flywheel though.

I now have an AP driveplate (which I bought for half the price Abbott sell them for!) and there is no chance of slippage. The clutch take up is a bit of a pain though. For the money (GBP145) it is a bargain.

Alanb
 

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I switched from the standard clutch to the Viggen one. No problems so far. But I have only done 10K on it. The previous clutch gave up after about 11K, so a few more miles to go before I know for cert
.
 

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The Viggen clutch is reasonably robust. Stanley is putting down some pretty good torque, but as the standard Viggen puts out roughly 400 NM in stock form, and has a 50,000 mile warranty, it should be more than sufficient for all those 2.0 engines out there. Even a stage 5 MapTun 2.0 gets only just barely to the Viggen's stock torque.

My only gripe is with the stock Saab tranny that gets hot and sloppy after 20-30 mins of around town running. (which would sound very dirty if this weren't a car conversation)

When my gearbox goes I'm planning on getting all the internal parts coated. Even considering rigging up a gearbox cooler system if the coatings aren't sufficient. The coatings are supposed to reduce temps significantly. I'm also going to try the MT "60" gearbox lube soon ... if I can get down to the dealer soon anyway.


Dubbya~
 

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quote Adrian:
 When my gearbox goes..  [/b]
Having taken two to their afterlife on a 2.3L NA GM900S, I learnt a lot about how the SAAB gearbox should be treated . TLC is Numero Uno. I don't do smoking tyres anymore, or violent shifts.
 

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I'm also looking into an uprated clutch for my Aero. It's only a Maptun Stage 1 but when on song (1.3 bar boost measured by WMSS on their calibrated gauge) will make the 20k mile old standard clutch slip in 3rd, 4th and 5th.

Having looked into the options I'm going for the Sachs Comp clutch (full kit) which at £440 + fitting + VAT is a touch expensive. When I contacted AP which was the cheaper route I received the following e-mail reply

"All we could offer is a cerametalic driven plate to use in conjunction with the OE pressure plate. This is a group N race specification adhering to the regulations. The most it would improve torque rating over standard would be 10%! The driven plates function is no increase burst strength and improve initial take up bite."

As the Stage 1 increase in torque is more than 10% I decided not to persue this option.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Aeroboy, may I ask where you are getting the Sachs Comp clutch from as my local specialist didn't get much joy from Sachs when he phoned them. Would be good if I could tell him Monday where to get a comp one. I'd pretty much resigned myself to getting a new standard one fitted (car's booked in for Wednesday) as it's getting a bit tedious having a slipping clutch every time I press the throttle a bit too hard

As to price, well I've been quoted about £200 + fitting for the standard one, but if the comp one lasts longer then it could work out cheaper in the long run.
 

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Aeroboy,

I think that AP is being very conservaytive with the 10% figure. I and many others are running some quite heavily tuned cars with not the slightest hint of slip from the pressure plate.

Alanb
 

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Matt, I'll be getting mine through WMSS though there is a two/three week wait for delivery.

I was also surprised with AP's response. I guess they would be very interested to hear how well their ceramic clutch performs in real world situations.
 

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I don't believe the AP rating of 10% over standard either. I had a new standard clutch that was comfortably slipping at what I reckon was around 300lbft. I changed to the AP paddle (cerametallic) and have since gone 350lbft plus and can't get it to budge at all.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Originally posted by Aeroboy:
[qb]Matt, I'll be getting mine through WMSS though there is a two/three week wait for delivery.

[/qb][/b]
Thanks for the information Aeroboy, my local indy is back on the case now. Apparently the clutch is good for 600Nm
so there shouldn't be any problems with slip anymore (Maptun stg 3 is 440Nm).
 

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You can buy both parts separately as the pressure plate will work with the OE friction plate. It is worth noting that the Sachs friction plate is cheaper than a Saab one.
 
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