[ComradeMisha]

i want to spend several thousands dollars instantly to make my SAAB a perfromance monster, so i have been considering purchasing the 3.0t and emmediately upgrading the LP Turbo to a much larger high performance one. the aero already comes with a considerable turbo, but the 4 cylinders put on certain restrictions... would it be possible, feasable, and more efficient to purchase the 3.0t arc?
KBB SAAB information (price, engine specs)
by the way, i have reconsidered and am now going with a manual... i had previously been set on an auto so this is quite a change for me.

 

[billj]

The reason Saab only lightly turbocharge the V6 engine is that it is nowhere near as strong as the 2.3. In fact, when they fitted the V6 to the 900 and 9000, they didn't turbocharge it at all. I don't know if it is much improved for the 9-5, but the same engine was never highly-regarded for longevity and smoothness in the earlier cars.

The 2.3T engine is a great base for tuning. What restrictions do you consider that four cylinders impose?

 

[ComradeMisha]

i would like to get the car to over 330 hp, so since the 4 cyl turbo already comes pretty fat, it becomes difficult and unstable to crank the 4 cyls up to that level... do you think otherwise? would a 4 cyl 2.3 beat out a 6 cyl 3.o with a huge turbo?

 

[billj]

I'm not an expert on the Saab/Opel V6, but from what I've heard, it's not strong enough to output 300+hp. The 2.3T, however, is no problem. My 9000 Aero is producing over 300hp, currently limited by the flow capacity of the fuel system. Mark E's CS 2.3T has a larger turbo and injectors and he's expecting it to produce 350hp - I think that's quite realistic, too.

Maptun, to whom both Mark and I have gone for tuning, have a 450hp 9000 2.3T that I'm told goes rather quickly. However, I've heard that the limit for reliable running on the 2.3T engine is around 350hp, beyond which it's a good idea to look at using stronger pistons.

Look around for power upgrades for the 3.0 V6. If you find any, let me know, because I can't. I've just done a quick scan of Hirsch, Maptun, Speedparts and Abbott and turned up nothing.

Would a tuned 2.3T "beat" a tuned 3.0 V6? I'm not sure, but I'm pretty sure it would outlast it...

 

[ComradeMisha]

it sounds quite pathetic that a v6 is so weak

 

[matt lloyd gould]

it's made by g.m

 

[burre]

Hirsch Performance will be bringing a heavily modded 9-5 Aero to the Tuner GP at Hockenheim this weekend. The laast time I was there they still didn't have final dyno numbers but I think they will end up at around 350 hp. Also, if you have the cash, the 2.3 can be internally modded and taken even further. There is a guy from Belgium that has his Viggen in Sweden getting punched out to 2.5 liters as well as a large amount of other mods that is going to probably be 400+ hp. So the potential of the 2.3 is there.

And although it is a pure race engine, Per Exklund's Pike's Peak racecar is a heavily modified 2.0 that pumps out around 700 hp!

So what I am saying is if you have the resources, the potential of the 4 cylinder engines is there. And as already stated, I have heard the V6 is not up to being modded as much as the 2.3. The fact that the highest performing model from Saab is the 2.3 should tell you that.

 

[billj]

Originally posted by Comrade Misha:
[qb]it sounds quite pathetic that a v6 is so weak      [/qb][/b]

I prefer to think that the 2.3 is highly over-engineered and is exceptionally strong.

 

[murphwiz]

The V6 can be tuned.. but how long it will last is another thing

Nordic do a kit...
Nordic which only takes you 10bhp over a std 02 on Aero...


But if your after reliable tuning, at some serious power levels then out of the 2 the only choice is the 2.3 4 cylinder.. as has already been said, 300bhp is an easy target without major mods!
Maptun offer a 350 Bhp conversion for the Aero

 

[aeropilot]

Originally posted by Comrade Misha:
it sounds quite pathetic that a v6 is so weak

Just because it's a V6 rather than a 4-cyl, does'nt mean it should be stronger.....An engines strength comes from it's design, NOT it's configuration. The LPT-V6 in the 9-5 is not a Saab designed engine, it's a GM-Vauxhall/Opel designed unit with a Saab developed turbo arrangement, and so is cheap and nasty. It's engineered like your average back yard shed, whereas the Saab designed B23XX 4-cyl is engineered like the Golden Gate Bridge.....

Unfortunatley, it seems likely that Saab will never be allowed to design an engine again, and will have to put up with GM/Isuza or Suburu units from now on....

 

[billj]

Originally posted by Leon (agent K):
[qb]Maptun offer a  350 Bhp conversion  for the Aero[/qb][/b]

Interesting that to get 350hp from the 9-5 Aero, Maptun add new pistons and camshafts, while they can manage 340hp on the 9000 Aero without them.

 

[murphwiz]

Originally posted by BillJ:
[qb] QUOTE

Originally posted by Leon (agent K):
[qb]Maptun offer a  350 Bhp conversion  for the Aero[/qb][/b]

Interesting that to get 350hp from the 9-5 Aero, Maptun add new pistons and camshafts, while they can manage 340hp on the 9000 Aero without them. [/qb][/b][/quote]I'd imagine this is due to the 9-5 engine being quite a bit different to the 9000 engine...
It shares the same design but its lighter, and lighter on an engine means less metal!

So the pistons would appear to be good for 305bhp (Hirsch) but maptun obviously feel for whatever reason new pistons are needed for 350bhp... I'll take thier word for it!

 

[James]

So have you decided on a 9-5 for your PimpMobile, Comrade? Or are the Volvo and Audi still in the frame?

 

[ComradeMisha]

its a shame they dont have a good 6 turbo to offer.. but a 350hp 4 is quite original! they are not out of the running yet, but it looks like it will be the saab. ventilated seats with 3 speeds, in las vegas the summers get extremely hot (120 degrees) so it might be worth it to get the car just for the seats can a 9-5 accomodate 19" rims, by the way?

 

[injectie]

Comrade, Just out of curiousity... Why did you change your mind on the gearbox? As you were certain to get an autobox and now stating to go for the manual after all.

 

[pyronerd]

Yes, Comrade, the 9-5 should have no trouble with 19" rims. Good choice changing your mind on the gearbox, manuals deliver such

in our Saabs

 

[ComradeMisha]

i went to the saab dealership and soberly test drove the manual 9-5 aero (non wagon- american demand for manual high performance wagons is quite low, according to the guy) and really enjoyed it. the sales rep tried to get me not to buy a manual wagon because resale value plumets.. he showed me the 9-3 vector and claimed it would be the better choice for me because it also has rearwheel steering to compensate. that would make for great handling. dissapointing that its not offered in the 9-5.
when i put this puppy up to the maptune stage 5 (currently my aftermarket choice) i wont be thinking of selling it for a while.

<<<<<
does anyone put nitrous to their saab, by the way? a friend of mine who was big on mustangs asked me.. howabout changing the flywheel?

 

[ComradeMisha]

i inquired to Maptune as to why they change the pistons in stg 5 on the 95 aero, and they didnt with the 9000. this is what they wrote back to me:
"We have a couple of 9000 with over 500 hp, that they still has the original pistons, so that is no problem. The 9-5 models do not have the same kind of pistons, so it has to be replaced."
- [email protected]

 

[1989agoodvintage]

The 9-5 models do not have the same kind of pistons, so it has to be replaced."[/b]

Blame the accountants at GM for making the 9-5 engines weaker than the engines they superceded.

 

[murphwiz]

Originally posted by Jason (Mr Torque-Steer):
[qb] QUOTE

The 9-5 models do not have the same kind of pistons, so it has to be replaced."[/b]

Blame the accountants at GM for making the 9-5 engines weaker than the engines they superceded.

[/qb][/b][/quote]Not really the accounts fault..
It would've been cheaper to drop the 9000 engine in there unchanged don't you think?

Combination of things... new emmissions targets... Weight, low inertia, leads to better economy...
And with the 'weak' 4 cylinder they have produced the most powerful production engine in the 02on 9-5 Aero with 250bhp... so its can't be THAT bad can it?
It just might not last as long as the old 9000 engine...