Dealer Warranty

[john.macneill@talktalk.net]

Hi

Looking for advice if possible.

Just bought a Saab from a reputable 'high performance dealership'. However, the car (a 55 plate 120 Linear) came with a 28 day parts only Warranty. I am not sure if this is standard practice, but I didnt force the issue at the time. After a couple of weeks I have found that the rear screen demister is not working. The top 4/5 elements are not working. He has looked at it and said there was nothing that could be done.

I have still to collect the car. However, would this not be classed as a 'part' and should he not look to replace the rear screen or is he within his rights to class this as being outwith the Warranty?

Dont want any agro, but I can see there being a problem here

Thanks

John

[sgould]

Yes it's a "part". If the elements are broken the radio may have poor reception and interference, especially when the heateed screen is switched on.. The heating elements are the FM aerial. The AM aerial is a separate line on there too.

[john.macneill@talktalk.net]

well, the dealer has told me that it is not covered....and to quote what he stated

"Windows etc would not even come under a new car warranty. This can not be repaired sadly."

What should I do next? The car is nearly 5 years old with 39k miles, however I must admit, I am a bit 'miffed' at this response

John

[sgould]

Sounds a bit of a dodgy dealer to me! Doesn't bode well for the future if anything else goes wrong. And 28 days warranty is probably illegally short.

You can repair the heating elements. There's conducting paint that's made for the purpose. I got some from Halfords. You need to be careful with masking tape to make it look reasonable. The biggest problem is usually finding the breaks.

To be honest, I would walk away now. There are plenty of good dealers out there. And lots of cars.

[john.macneill@talktalk.net]

He is established. His showroom has prestige cars, some of which have been over 100k. I think the Saab was the cheapet car in the place. I think it is a bit of sour grapes to be honest. He gave me more than I expected for mine.....in fact it is now for sale £300 less than I got trade-in. Maybe he is not happy with that fact, I really dont know.

I cannot fault the car. It had 2 x issues.One with the passenger side door mirror and the rear elements. The top 4/5 elements (please tell me they are elements and not part of the aerial!!) would not work. He has addressed the mirror issue but said the window is not covered. I am away from home at the moment so I cannot read the T&C's of his Warranty, but as an independent Dealer, a 28 day parts warranty may be 'standard' on a 5 year old car. In a sense it is partly my fault that I did not even ask about Warranty before buying the car.

What I need to determine is whether I have a case that the window SHOULD be covered. I can obviously try to have a go at fixing it or at some point get it replaced if it gets damaged by paying an excess, but I really thought the Dealer would have just got it replaced. I cannot 'walk away' unfortunatley as I have alreay bought the car, however, I have a bit of time to research where I stand before the 28 days runs out

The garage is only 5 miles from me, so I am within 'hassling' distance to him

John

[sgould]

I have no idea of the legal position. Scotland is different!

The heater elements and aerial are one and the same thing. There is an amplifier behind the trim at one side and a filter at the other end that split the heating voltage from the radio signal. So you will need to get them fixed as soon as possible. I can't remember how the elements are wired in, but all the top ones going out could be due to one wipe with a gritty cloth or else a break in the section at the side that feeds all the failed section.

[saabnumber5]

is this a warranty issue ? You haven't even collected the car yet, surely the warranty covers you after you have collected and driven off in the car.

I bought a Nissan ZX a good few years ago. Within days noticed the power steering fluid going down. Took it back to be told the steering rack was cracked. They then looked into the terms of the insurance backed warranty that I had which covered work up to £500 (it was a while ago). I pointed out that actually it wasn't a warranty issue at all. The car had the fault when I bought it. They covered the complete repair with no problems. They are now a very successful main dealer.

Hence my questions about your situation.

SN5

[john.macneill@talktalk.net]

?????

I have collected the car, that's why I know there is an issue. I have had the car for just over 2 weeks. I would never have known about the rear elements if it hadnt been frosty on Monday.

My problem is going to be, that he is already indicating he is not going to do the repair. On good terms with the guy, but not sure if it will last

John

[saabnumber5]

Sorry, misunderstood, your 'not collected it yet' Nothings changes though mate. It didn't work when you bought it, it's his responsibility. A subscription to Which Legal Services costs peanuts with instant access to advice. That said, you might also think it's not worth bothering with all the hassle.

SN5

[davidt]

Hi John, just had a look and Saab want £752 for a new rear window, maybe that's why they don't want to pay! Sratstone Saab in Birmingham have 1 for £468, maybe your dealer would go halves if you really wanted it replaced, just a thought.

[john.macneill@talktalk.net]

Thanks for the replies


I really just need to get to the bottom of whether it IS or IS NOT his responsibility. There is no way the customer would know a rear element wasnt working on a car in ANY garage until there comes a time when they need to use it. Also, there is a fair chance that the Dealer would not even know there was an issue until it was highlighted.

I will need to look at his warranty wording (if there is one) and I cant do this until I get back home on Friday. I just thought that the rear window or the element itself would be a part however that may come down his warranty wording. Its a 4 1//2 year old car so there does have to be some wear and tear but as I said, it would be impossible to know this 'part' had failed until the owner has purchased the car and had to use it

I have a feeling it's one I'm not going to win

Thanks

John

[drb1709]

A car is assembled from a number of 'parts', your rear screen is a part, and for what ever reason, it does not perform 100% of what it is meant to. The usual wording of such a guarantee is to separate the cost of labour and 'parts'. Therefore, the screen itself is under warranty, but the labour to install it is not. A dealer/garage will want to charge labour for this, although a windscreen company will not. Most garages will not do this sort of work themselves, but will get a windscreen company in to do it for them, and then the more unscrupulous ones will add on a labour charge. The threat of Trading Standards will usually get most dealers to accept their responsibilities.

[saabnumber5]

I will need to look at his warranty wording (if there is one) and I cant do this until I get back home on Friday. I just thought that the rear window or the element itself would be a part however that may come down his warranty wording. Its a 4 1//2 year old car so there does have to be some wear and tear but as I said, it would be impossible to know this 'part' had failed until the owner has purchased the car and had to use it[/b]

It's not a warranty issue. It's a sale of goods act issue. You have legal rights.

SN5

[quinophex]

Do you have trading standards in Scotland? If so I'd speak to them and ask their advice.

IANAL but in England a car has to be "fit for purpose" which means that condition is related to mileage and age, i.e. you can't expect an older car to have A1 trim and all the ancillaries working but it has to be mechanically sound and safe with no immediate problem unless disclosed at time of sale. As a working heated rear screen isn't a legal requirement then I would imagine it will be much harder to argue that he has to do something, also the repair doesn't have to consist of replacing the screen, he would be quite within his rights to attempt a repair using some screen repair paint or have a secondhand screen put in. You also haven't said how much you paid for the car or how many miles it has done, this will affect what quality you can expect it to be and what he has to do.

You say you have a warranty? Is this 3rd party? as if so then forget it, you will only be covered in the event that a mechanical part breaks down after the sale and it will most likely exclude glass. Many dealers sell a warranty so they can get out of having to prepare a car for sale properly and pay for repairs themselves if anything goes wrong.

If this was England then his "warranty" would be worthless but it's not that you are arguing over an actual breakdown. Legally you'd have to prove that the car is "unfit for purpose" which could prove to be hard but this is something that was wrong when the car was sold.

Anyhow, have you found out why the screen isn't working? is it that some of the elements are broken or is it that there is a problem with the wiring for the electrics etc? If it is just the element is broken in a couple of places then I'd think just getting some screen element repair paint would be the sensible option and doing it yourself as it will save your time arguing.