Yesterday I saw the Saab for the first time as it’s just arrived at my local dealer, and I’ll be test driving the demonstrator when it arrives in about a weeks time. Gotta say it looks fantastic despite the yucky lime green colour. Does anybody have a 9-3 with Selectronic? I’ve read the reviews and Top Gear say Selectronic is excellent whereas Car Magazine says it’s [expletive deleted]. What’s a real owner’s verdict?

Only downside I find with the Saab is the interior which is a bit plasticcy and the leather which just didn’t look particularly special. Is this improved by selecting wood trim and leather sports seating or does it just look tacky?

Thanks!

Oh BTW my other choices are the Audi A3 V6, A4 Cabrio and Merc CLK, but so far (before any test drives) the Saab is ahead!

Welcome to SSc, Froggy.

I think that Saab calls it: Sentronic (not to be confused with Saab Sensonic, which was something else, or Selespeed which is Alfa's name for it, or half a dozen other names http://www.saabscene.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Indeed, the interior has come in for a slating on the "quality" of the plastics used.

You should do your due diligence and drive all cars before buying. But be aware that the depreciation of Saabs are a bit of a surprise when selling it after a time of joy.

Example. I have a 9 3 Aero convertible, 2001 and 110.000 km, costed me around 40.000€. The sales guy of the saab shop, trying to sell me the new model with same specs, gives me 16.000€ for my car. That's minus 60% in 29 months...

Be aware...

I return to another brand, no more Saab for me

If you buy a new car you will lose a lot of money, whichever make you buy.

Beware of the "low depreciation" quoted for some German cars. Depreciation is the same, but the new price quoted is "list" and doesn't include the extra accessories that they need.

For example people will quote that their BMW fell to £16,000 in 2 1/2 years. List price is £30,000 so it looks quite good value. But they didn't pay list they paid £40,000 because the radio, aircon, leather etc. were extra to the "list" price..

Thanks for all the replies. One of my concerns (apart from the less-than-impressive interior)was the possible depreciation. I asked the salesman about it and he said that being a cabrio it should hold it's value well (well he would say that)Seeing that Saab isn't very well known in France I reckon the Germans, apart from the A3 V6, will hold their value better.

However as VW UK kindly dropped their prices 20% about 6 months after I paid £19 grand + for my GTI in 1999, it will have lost about 60 - 70% of it's value when I come to sell it. So VW aren't so good either!

Originally posted by Niels:
* That's minus 60% in 29 months...

Be aware...

I return to another brand, no more Saab for me [/b]That sounds about right - which is why I got such a good deal when I bought my Saab at 36 months old. It depends on whether you are seller or buyer and when you are buying or selling. All (with few exceptions) cars will depreciate. For some, the depreciation is more rapid than others.

The best way to save on depreciation is to keep the car for years and years!!

After 5 years it won't be worth much and so you save money after that.

After spending a lot of money on a lot of cars since 1962, I am only on my third car since 1989.

Austin Montego 2.0L 1989 - 94 135,000 miles
Rover 620Si 1994 - 2002 161,000 miles
Saab 95 2.3SE 2002 - http://www.saabscene.com/forum/images/smilies/fawlty.gif

It is one of the great benefits of the UK car registration system. You can buy a personal number and keep it for ever on any car. That way you can buy a secondhand car, put the number on and the neighbours will think it's new (This won't work any more on old 9-3's and 9000's though )

Hiya!

You've probably seen my posts but I adore my new Saab 9-3 Convertible.

I've got the parchment leather interior and it looks wonderful. I've had a lot of comments about it. The depreciation, for me itn't an issue, it was more about me having a car that I really wanted. I love every aspect of my new car but like everything, it's all down to personal taste. I know it certainly turns heads! And looks much sexier than a BMW Convertible and sportier than the Audi Convertible.

I'd say, have a drive, you'll know if you love it.

Originally posted by sgould:
For example people will quote that their BMW fell to £16,000 in 2 1/2 years. *List price is £30,000 so it looks quite good value. *But they didn't pay list they paid £40,000 because the radio, aircon, leather etc. were extra to the "list" price.. [/b]I agree.

Don't pay for lots of extras! These are worth nothing when you come to sell the car because not everyone wants them. E.g. friend of mine bought a new Audi S3 with every conceivable option including TV and paid £32k+. 12 months on he has been offered £18k by the dealer. Options count for nothing on resale.

The good thing about the Saab is that many items that are options on the Audi/Merc will be standard on the Saab. Just do your homework.

It's a fact, whichever way you look at it, that brand new Saabs do not hold their price well.

Equivalent BMW, Audi and Mercs will be a sounder "investment" - and here's the catch - if you pay list.

You really have got to play hard and dirty with Saab dealers (although I suspect it's difficult with the 93 Convertible at the moment because of high demand and being a good looking car).

In my experience the "German" dealers are hell to haggle with (though it can be done) but if you really play it clever you can get some serious discounts from Saab - play off dealers against each other, play off import prices against them, haggle for extras, haggle for finance deals - a friend got 0% finance on a 95 2 litre LPT Vector last year.

Regardless of the position with the 93 Convertible at the moment - and I reckon "deals" will really flow in 12 months time - Saab is absolutely desperate to get vehicles on the roads (look at the free servicing deals they are throwing at the 95!! - can you imagine BMW doing that - oh no you won't).

If you want the 93 Convertible "now" (despite that Kia interior http://www.saabscene.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif I reckon it's better than the rest) you may struggle for a "deal" but come 2004...........

We are just about to change our 2000 9-3 convertible for a new one. At only 24000kms, Saab have offered £14500 for it (i.e 54% of cost new £26995). However, it is leased and the lease company want £17200 to purchase!!!

Also, if you can get it in France, read the October of Car magazine - comparison between Saab, Audi, BMW and Merc convertibles. The other 3 all cost at least £5000 more than the Saab to offer the same spec, and the Saab comes a close second to the (much more expensive) BMW in the roadtest.

Originally posted by Fawlty:
*Saab have offered £14500 for it (i.e 54% of cost new £26995). However, it is leased and the lease company want £17200 to purchase!!!
[/b]But I bet when the Saab daler sold it he'd be asking somewhere about £27,500 for it

Depreciation - driving a Saab is price of being and individual and different - so if you have strong herd instincts then you'll generally find a BMW/Audi/Merc will suit your requirements admirably.

It really is as simple as that - ALL cars are a waste of money and very poor investment. Period.

Originally posted by John Worth:
It really is as simple as that - ALL cars are a waste of money and very poor investment. Period. [/b]Poor investment - yep!

Waste of money - no way! Worth every penny imho

Buying a car is like gambling. If you can't afford to lose it all, you shouldn't play the game.

I suppose that owning one is like being a drug addict - throwing money at a habit..... Better not think that argument through though http://www.saabscene.com/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif

Depreciation is also closely connected to the amount of kilometres on the dash. Once 120.000km passed the residual value of any Saab drops tremendously. It's not a car to eat kilometres but use as second car and pose around...

I fully disagree with the comparison and depreciation of German cars, they surely hold their value better because demand is much higher after some years of driving.

Originally posted by Niels:
Depreciation is also closely connected to the amount of kilometres on the dash. *Once 120.000km passed the residual value of any Saab drops tremendously. *It's not a car to eat kilometres but use as second car and pose around...
[/b]I disagree. Given that the vehicle, if looked after, is capable of a gazillion miles ( divide by five and multiply by eight for kilometres ) then there is no reason why it should not be driven.

I take the train to work each day but have still managed to rack up in excess of 20,000 miles in one year, that's 32,000km, I think? http://www.saabscene.com/forum/images/smilies/fawlty.gif Why spend the majority of your time in an inferior vehicle in order to lessen depreciation on the Saab. Forget depreciation, keep the car for a while and enjoy driving it.

in an inferior vehicle...

That's an understatement: I'll give you some qualities of my 40.000 Euro Saab:

Water leaks left and right on mirrors height(convertible, remember. Since 30 months now)
Excessive rattle and squeecking over rough road
Torque steer (extremely dangerous on wet underground)
Stereo loses bass sound after a while
Fogging light (left side)
Car needs servicing every 10.000 km (expensive!)
Roof not always opens (need to 'shake it')

In other words, I am so fed up with this piece of junk, it is not only depreciated as hell but the car itself has become unpossible to sell, I really need to drive it some more and eventually crash it against a wall or so.

All my other cars were surely not inferior to this car.

Seems like you got a Friday afternooner, Niels.

My wife has virtually the same car as you (late 2000, 2001 model lpt airflow) and we have had no problems at all. None, and certainly none of those you mention. It hasn't been especially well cared for and stands outside. The car is perfect - so perfect I'm having trouble persuading her we need to get the new one

Dream , dream , dream , any car is a good investement , take the insurance , the maintenance , tyres , fuel , etc , in the end nobody makes money on there cars .

The Germain are the same as the others , what people tend to forget is the price when new is much high .

A friend who have a 911 was very proud of the price he sold of is car , than i ask the amount of money spend to keep the car in good shape , he was very p.... off !

It's no consolation but Niels' experience sounds exceptional. But it is the sort of experience that could put one of a car make for life.

I've got two friends who've each owned a GM900 convertible without drama - and my own experience (of coupes I'll admit) has been exceptionally good.

Having sat in, and drooled over, a new 93 convertible today I'm totally converted (pun intended) - even without a Saab biased head on this is the only convertible choice

(Even the interior plastics looked OK )

Someone , friend of a friend bought a Audi S4 Avant , 3 years ago , brand new , costs (without tyres and normal maintenance) 18.500 sfr !!!

Audi , for this guy , never ever again . Every time he goes to the dealer always the same answer " Sir you drive too fast" , so no garantie .

He whants to give is car as part exchange to buy a M5 , no way !

Before he have a Sub Impreza Turbo , no problem at all , ... heee yes , one , the turbo blow at 165.000kms .

Thanks for all the replies. The depreciation is definitely a concern, although the new cab is supposed to be massive step up in quality to the old one, so it might hold it's value better.

Captain Aero, i asked the dealer here about discounts and he wasn't very forthcoming. Firstly I'm not sure if the French are really into massive haggling with car dealers like in the UK and secondly Saabs are not that common over here (can't find any signs of magazines and TV road testing the new cabrio). I suppose on the haggling front I'll have to ask people what the form is and then try my luck.

Fawlty I actually subscribe to Car but October never arrived . Typical as it's testing 2 of the cars I'm interested in (well the CLK coupe as the cabrio is too expensive)

I think the proof will be in the testing.Having seen the Saab in the flesh, am very keen, but suppose I'll only decide once I've tested them all.

Incidentally any views on Sentronic (thanks John!) autos? As I said TG loved it but Car hated it

Originally posted by Froggy:
*I actually subscribe to Car but October never arrived * * *[/b]I have subscribed to Car for years. I have had a couple of occasions when the mag didn't arrive. A phone call to them got another one sent straight away. No dispute, no argument.

If you're looking at a new convertible, the full road test is in there.

][/QUOTE]I have subscribed to Car for years. I have had a couple of occasions when the mag didn't arrive. A phone call to them got another one sent straight away. No dispute, no argument.

If you're looking at a new convertible, the full road test is in there. [/QB][/QUOTE]

Am on virtually first name terms with the subscriptions department for resendings! Unfortunately 1 in 3 issues (also Classic Cars) go astray. Car and CC are annoyingly sent under transparent cover so the thieving ******* french postmen see the mags and you can guess the rest.... Unfortunately they are just as bad with other packages with approx 50% never arriving from the UK!

'fraid I can't quite get around to reprinting the whole Car test here, froggy, but this is waht I wrote in the "saab wins test(well, almost)" thread below this one:

"Just reading it - it's the Vector 175bhp convertible (£26990, but £31595 as tested) - for some reason pitched against the BMW 330Ci (231bhp, £36800), Merc CLK320 (215bhp, £44970) and Audi A4 3.0V6 (217bhp, £33070).

The interesting thing to me is not that it beats the expensive Merc or hold its own with the vastly more powerful beemer, it's that it absolutely blows away the Audi. The Saab is top in categories practicality, safety, value,and second to the beemer in ride and performance. The only category it is 3rd in (still beating the merc) is driver environment, which is basically personal taste. Even though we've criticised the new 9-3's interior and dash extensively on this site (and yes, Car pick out the silly placcy "CD slot" thingy for criticism NB Saab), one look at the four interiors on offer here and I know I'd take the Saab. They also say it has the best seats, and ity's the only one with standard leather. All of us who've owned convertibles have been caught in the rain once or twice - leather in a 'vertible is a no-brainer .

So is the winner of this test. Again, residuals are singled out as worse in the Saab - and again, I'd like to know how they are calculated on a brand new car (and, by the way, our 3 year old 9-3 convertible has just been valued at 66% of its original price - higher than the 3 German cars in the test).

But the beemer only beats it on ride and performance - with 231 brake so it should . Try accommodating two 6 footers in the back of the beemer "

Thanks Fawlty

Hopefully it should arrive this week. I agree that it's strange that they pitched the 175bhp Saab against much more powerful rivals, especially as all the other makes have available models with similar sized engines

Got mine last Friday. Here's a picture:
http://www.beckconsulting.co.uk/Saab.jpg

Or failing that, a link to the picture:

My Saab (http://www.beckconsulting.co.uk/Saab.jpg)

The car is steel grey, which actually looks darker in real life than in the picture.

Very nice GrumpyNick